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Re: Meteorite "worth" (warning: long and opinionated!)

Hello Steve,

No need to get inflammatory or personal.   The Russian and Cuban
'governments' may have more experience in artificial pricing, not the
people.  Gene is only issuing a caveat so that the government does not have
to step in.

I think we should honor other's wishes to end this thread.  Everyone has
made their point.  The subject will orbit again!!!

Best regards,
Julia

-----Original Message-----
From: MeteorHntr@aol.com <MeteorHntr@aol.com>
To: rmarlin@network-one.com <rmarlin@network-one.com>
Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com
<meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Monday, April 05, 1999 2:45 PM
Subject: Re: Meteorite "worth" (warning: long and opinionated!)


|In a message dated 4/5/99 12:03:53 PM Central Daylight Time,
|rmarlin@network-one.com writes:
|
|<< But to assign a
| high commercial value, so that they can no longer be obtained is, to me, a
| sort of sacrilege.
| >>
|
|Hello Gene and list,
|
|Who, pray tell, is "assigning" high commercial values to these just so you
|can't get any?  I think the whole lesson in understanding all this is that
|the market forces are too big for ANYONE to seriously effect.  That goes
for
|the farmers finding them, the dealers who buy and sell them, and the people
|who collect them.
|
|No one is out there saying "I don't like Gene, so I am going to make ALL
|meteorites so high priced that Gene can't (or won't want to) buy them!"
|There may be a few dealers trying to artificially push up the prices, but
|that is only a temporary event.  If the market won't allow the high prices,
|then the dealers won't sell any of their stock, and they will be forced to
|sell them cheaper or to sit on them.
|
|I have sold over well over 1,000 pounds of meteorites, to mostly dealers,
in
|the last 7 years.  And trust me the #1 consideration on how much they will
|pay me for a rock is based upon what "the market" in turn will pay them for
|it.  Not once has any of them said "I want to buy this so I can price it so
|high that no one can afford to buy it, especially that Gene fellow."
|
|Take Haag's Calcalong Creek Lunar meteorite.  I have heard he was asking $1
|Million/gr for it.  If that was the case, he was probably pricing it so
high
|that no one would buy it (not that he was thinking of you personally
Gene.).
|Not that he wanted force prices higher, but the real truth probably was
that
|he didn't want to sell it at all.  But if anyone that came along with
|$1,000,000 and was crazy enough to buy some, he would be smart enough to
sell
|off a gram.
|
|But the truth of the matter is Haag is himself a collector.  So he really
is
|in the market equation twice, both as a collector and a dealer.  But so is
|Steve Schoner, and about all the other dealers in the business.
|
|I have a very small personal collection, worth probably around $200 tops.
|But I have a little 3.5g Imilac that is in the shape of a Crab that has
green
|crystals in/on it.  Out of about 7,000 Imilacs I have personally found at
the
|site, this is the only one with green crystals.  What is it worth?  Little
|Imilacs sell for typically $2 to $10/g, so mine is only worth $35 max,
right?
| To a crab collector, it might be worth $50.  To a jewelry maker, it might
be
|worth $75.  Well, I won't sell it for $200.  So what is it worth?  Am I
|trying to push up the price so you can't afford it?  No, I just don't want
to
|sell it.  Make me a $1,000 offer and I will think about it.
|
|The point is, the market is way too complicated to attempt to control.
|
|If you want to stop buying, like Steve Schoner has, that is ok, but I think
|there is a better use of a "collectors club" than to try to control prices
in
|a downward fashion.  But if that is your objective, go for it.  Just don't
|cloak it with other objectives such as Political Lobbying, spreading useful
|information, group field hunting trips and building "unity" with the
|scientific community, to build membership only try to lower prices.
|
|Which brings up a point, what if such a club was successful?
|
|What if the prices would fall to say 1933 prices?  Wouldn't that make
|meteorites more affordable?  And therefore, there would be more collectors
|coming into the field competing for specimens since they could afford them
|now?  Imagine Esquel for $0.20/g, Nakhla for $5/g, Lunar specimens for
$10/g,
|Canyon Diablos for $1/lb, ordinary chondrites for $2/pound.  We would see
our
|hobby grow to maybe 100,000 people, maybe even 1,000,000 collectors or
|more!!!
|
|Then guess what?  Scientists would all be mad because they wouldn't be able
|to get meteorites anymore like they used to in the "good old days of 1999,
|when there were fewer collectors competing for them because the prices were
|so high!"  The researchers would then want to pass laws restricting
meteorite
|collecting because they would be too cheap!
|
|Trust me, getting meteorites down to "reasonable Beanie Baby level" to
|attract the numbers of Beanie Baby collectors would just push prices back
up
|again.  Ever try push an air filled ball under water?  You can do it a
little
|ways for a little while.
|
|Yes, there will always be guys like Haag with his Calcalong Creek, me with
my
|Imilac Crab and Schoner with his prized big Gloretta's that will keep
certain
|items out of everyone's hands (or at least until we die).  But over all,
the
|"invisible hand" of the market forces will keep things in line.
|
|And hey if the experiment fails, you can always move to Russia or Cuba and
|work with folks who have a lot more experience in artificial pricing.
|
|Steve Arnold
|
|
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