[meteorite-list] Tough question for collectors

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From: MexicoDoug_at_aol.com <MexicoDoug_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Thu Apr 22 10:32:52 2004
Message-ID: <42.49789859.2d8f1426_at_aol.com>

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Hola Jay,

I noticed you are suggesting to make the awards from meteoric iron, and that=
=20
you mentioned the award is called "Guide Star". For whatever its worth to=20
you, here are my comments:

0. You will need 73-76% the weight of iron meteorite (density about 7.9 g/mL=
)=20
to make something the same size as sterling silver (density about 10.3 g/mL)=
,=20
which is very very nearly a third heavier.

1. Assuming the award has something to do with service, and the concept of=20=
a=20
"guide star" is based on guidance...i.e. is based on the idea of navigation=20
using the stars, I would hesitate on the iron meteorite for one undesirable=20
aspect: We are pretty sure that the iron meteorites, which represent less t=
han=20
one in 10 meteorites, are from larger asteroids that had mid space collision=
s=20
with such terrific force that the very core of them was fractured and propel=
led=20
randomly in space after their collision. So from that perspective, if there=
=20
is to be some romance in the idea, I am not sure it makes them appropriate,=20
unless you frame it as navigating to collide and be at least partly destroye=
d. =20
I would see the collision as more applicable to a marriage but then I would=20
use a mesosiderite as sort of a yin-yang idea representing each person (a=20
mesosiderite may contain a mixture of stone and iron from two bodies that co=
llided=20
and whoever wears the pants can be the iron:)

2. Similarly, the asteroids, minor planets, are like the planets, in that=20
they are not fixed in position but wander against the starry sky. As a matt=
er=20
of fact they are sometimes perturbed and thus are even less useful than the=20
planets for guidance if they were visible, but are too small anyway (usually=
). =20
The iron cores, while they were not formed on Earth are no more stars than a=
ny=20
Earth rock or melted metal.=20

3. If you melt the iron, why would you want meteoritic iron in the first=20
place? You would have effectively killed the only real tie this matter has=20=
with i
ts provenence. The patterns are what really define its extraterrestrial=20
nature.

4. On the plus side, there are some meteorites which are suspected to be mad=
e=20
of star dust, i.e., the raw material that made the Earth, asteroids, etc. =20
Some materials are more primitive than others. Perhaps you can inlay a smal=
l=20
amount of a primitiver one, and perhaps completely engulf it with some clear=
=20
resin as a centerpiece of your award.

5. Another option for me for such an award would be to incorporate a nice=20
prism in the award that catches and separates Sunlight. True starlight ...=20=
and=20
gives everyone the ability to navigate...

6. If these considerations aren't relevant you could use a common iron and=20
let the imagination write the rest of the story! I am sure someone could se=
ll=20
you the blanks (we saw lots of Widmannst=E4tten pattern etched "space coins"=
at=20
the Tucson show) and you could just do the engraving. They are no doubt=20
carved rather than melted. You could always buy a "slice" of the desired th=
ickness=20
and chip away at the edges to make your pattern, if you have the right tools=
.=20
A shop grinding stone used sparingly and slowly would probably do just fine=
=20
for the finishing touches, whether rounded or angular. Then engrave it, bak=
e=20
it, and coat it with something so it won't rust.

Hope this is of some use...

Saludos
Doug Dawn
Mexico

En un mensaje con fecha 03/21/2004 5:21:02 AM Mexico Standard Time,=20
User5013_at_aol.com escribe:

> Asunto: [meteorite-list] Tough question for collectors=20
> Fecha: 03/21/2004 5:21:02 AM Mexico Standard Time
> De: User5013_at_aol.com
> Para: meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
> Enviado por Internet=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Hi,
>=20
> I'm an amateur jeweler who makes awards &medallions for a couple clubs I=20
> belong to. I've been asked to make several medallions for an award called=
a=20
> "Guide Star."
>=20
> Previously, I have made them of silver, Sterling, even gold. I now have a=
=20
> client who wants to sponsor four medallions -- and wants to make them very=
=20
> special. Since the award is a Guide Star, he thinks it would be neat to m=
ake=20
> this set of four medallions out of a true star -- a meteorite.
>=20
> Sounds like a cool idea to me, but I have no real knowledge of the raw=20
> material. While searching the web, I've discovered great passion for coll=
ecting=20
> that I was completely unaware of. Such incredible passion, that I'm now v=
ery=20
> unsure of whether to proceed with the project.
>=20
> I'm certain that recasting the iron-nickel alloy would destroy the=20
> Widmanstaetten figures which are so prized among collectors. Yet, I canno=
t think of=20
> another process by which I would make the medallions. (I am, after all, o=
nly=20
> an amateur.)
>=20
> Before I go any further with this project, I'm asking your people for=20
> information. I seek opinions from collectors (pro, con, philosophy). I a=
lso seek=20
> functional information (melting temperature and density comes to mind). A=
=20
> medallion of silver weighs 4 ounces, so how much meteorite . . .?
>=20
> Anything you could provide would be most helpful before I continue. Pleas=
e=20
> no flame-ing, yet.
>=20
> Thank you,
> Jay Toser
> user5013_at_aol.com
> 135 Lazy Lake Dr.
> Fall River WI 53932=20

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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<HTML><HTML>Hola Jay, 
 
I noticed you are suggesting to make the awards from meteoric iron, and that=
you mentioned the award is called "Guide Star".  For whatever its wort=
h to you, here are my comments: 
 
0. You will need 73-76% the weight of iron meteorite (density about 7.9 g/mL=
) to make something the same size as sterling silver (density about 10.3 g/m=
L), which is very very nearly a third heavier. 
 
1.  Assuming the award has something to do with service, and the concep=
t of a "guide star" is based on guidance...i.e. is based on the idea of navi=
gation using the stars, I would hesitate on the iron meteorite for one undes=
irable aspect:  We are pretty sure that the iron meteorites, which repr=
esent less than one in 10 meteorites, are from larger asteroids that had mid=
space collisions with such terrific force that the very core of them was fr=
actured and propelled randomly in space after their collision.  So from=
that perspective, if there is to be some romance in the idea, I am not sure=
it makes them appropriate, unless you frame it as navigating to collide and=
be at least partly destroyed.  I would see the collision as more appli=
cable to a marriage but then I would use a mesosiderite as sort of a yin-yan=
g idea representing each person (a mesosiderite may contain a mixture of sto=
ne and iron from two bodies that collided and whoever wears the pants can be=
the iron:) 
 
2.  Similarly, the asteroids, minor planets, are like the planets, in t=
hat they are not fixed in position but wander against the starry sky. =20=
As a matter of fact they are sometimes perturbed and thus are even less usef=
ul than the planets for guidance if they were visible, but are too small any=
way (usually).  The iron cores, while they were not formed on Earth are=
no more stars than any Earth rock or melted metal. 
 
3. If you melt the iron, why would you want meteoritic iron in the first pla=
ce?  You would have effectively killed the only real tie this matter ha=
s with its provenence.  The patterns are what really define its extrate=
rrestrial nature. 
 
4. On the plus side, there are some meteorites which are suspected to be mad=
e of star dust, i.e., the raw material that made the Earth, asteroids, etc.&=
nbsp; Some materials are more primitive than others.  Perhaps you can i=
nlay a small amount of a primitiver one, and perhaps completely engulf it wi=
th some clear resin as a centerpiece of your award. 
 
5.  Another option for me for such an award would be to incorporate a n=
ice prism in the award that catches and separates Sunlight.  True starl=
ight ... and gives everyone the ability to navigate... 
 
6.  If these considerations aren't relevant you could use a common iron=
and let the imagination write the rest of the story!  I am sure someon=
e could sell you the blanks (we saw lots of Widmannst=E4tten pattern etched=20=
"space coins" at the Tucson show) and you could just do the engraving. =
They are no doubt carved rather than melted.  You could always buy a "=
slice" of the desired thickness and chip away at the edges to make your patt=
ern, if you have the right tools.  A shop grinding stone used sparingly=
and slowly would probably do just fine for the finishing touches, whether r=
ounded or angular.  Then engrave it, bake it, and coat it with somethin=
g so it won't rust. 
 
Hope this is of some use... 
 
Saludos 
Doug Dawn 
Mexico 
 
 
En un mensaje con fecha 03/21/2004 5:21:02 AM Mexico Standard Time, User5013=
_at_aol.com escribe: 
 
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=3DCITE style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT=
: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Asunto: [meteorite-list] Tou=
gh question for collectors 
Fecha: 03/21/2004 5:21:02 AM Mexico Standard Time 
De: <A HREF=3D"mailto:User5013_at_aol.com">User5013@aol.com</A> 
Para: <A HREF=3D"mailto:meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com">meteorite-list=
_at_meteoritecentral.com</A> 
Enviado por Internet 
 
 
 
Hi, 
 
I'm an amateur jeweler who makes awards &medallions for a couple clubs I=
belong to.  I've been asked to make several medallions for an award ca=
lled a "Guide Star." 
 
Previously, I have made them of silver, Sterling, even gold.  I now hav=
e a client who wants to sponsor four medallions -- and wants to make them ve=
ry special.  Since the award is a Guide Star, he thinks it would be nea=
t to make this set of four medallions out of a true star -- a meteorite. 
 
Sounds like a cool idea to me, but I have no real knowledge of the raw mater=
ial.  While searching the web, I've discovered great passion for collec=
ting that I was completely unaware of.  Such incredible passion, that I=
'm now very unsure of whether to proceed with the project. 
 
I'm certain that recasting the iron-nickel alloy would destroy the Widmansta=
etten figures which are so prized among collectors.  Yet, I cannot thin=
k of another process by which I would make the medallions.  (I am, afte=
r all, only an amateur.) 
 
Before I go any further with this project, I'm asking your people for inform=
ation.  I seek opinions from collectors (pro, con, philosophy).  I=
also seek functional information (melting temperature and density comes to=20=
mind).  A medallion of silver weighs 4 ounces, so how much meteorite .=20=
. .? 
 
Anything you could provide would be most helpful before I continue.  Pl=
ease no flame-ing, yet. 
 
Thank you, 
Jay Toser 
user5013_at_aol.com 
135 Lazy Lake Dr. 
Fall River  WI  53932 </BLOCKQUOTE> 
 
</HTML>
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Received on Sun 21 Mar 2004 10:52:06 AM PST

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