[meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers

From: Matt Morgan <mmorgan_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sun Nov 21 11:48:04 2004
Message-ID: <002601c4cfe9$d678b120$6400a8c0_at_D14191145L2K>

I understand this completely, but what I am getting at is cooperation
and sharing of data seems to happen very little or is non-existant. The
researchers I have worked with in the past also made visual pairings
(along with thin section work) if there were a large number of pieces.
They also took really good digital photos of cut specimens and thin
sections. These should be made available to others working on NWAs in
some central depository. Pairings could be made visually in many cases
by the proper authorities.

Also I think the "Total Known Weight" should really be observerved for
witnessed falls.
I have always thought it was a lame statistic for finds and is
constantly abused. It is one of the cruxes that the current argument
re: name stealing/borrwing hinges about.
Matt

-----Original Message-----
From: John Birdsell [mailto:birdsell_at_email.arizona.edu]
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 9:33 AM
To: Matt Morgan
Cc: meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers


Hi Matt and list. I'm not an expert on the topic, but I think that part
of the problem may also be that meteorites such as those belonging to
the HED group are quite heterogeneous. If one sample contains a slightly

higher diogenite component it may come back as a howardite while a
sample with a lower diogenite component may come back as a eucrite. I
would imagine that two samples from the same stone could conceivably
come back with a different classification. If anyone can comment on this

and correct me if I'm wrong I would appreciate it!


Cheers


-John


Matt Morgan wrote:

>Just to add a note...
>There is a fundamental scientific problem of classifying meteorites.
>
>Try sending two pieces of the same meteorite to different labs.
>Chances are you will get different results. For instance, I have "L5's"

>that came back as "L4's" and "L6's". "Regolith" this and "Primitive"
>that. I heard the same situation happening for NWA 1929, either
>howardite OR eucrite. I understand some of it is "interpretive".
>
>The system itself is flawed.
>
>Ideally, we need an NWA consortium of labs to correct this and have
>type specimens on hand.
>
>This SEEMS to be an easy fix, but university politics plays a huge
>role.
>
>So all you scientists who study NWA's, how about a network for
>meteorite "data sharing"? It will make ALL our lives easier...
>
>Matt Morgan
>Mile High Meteorites
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: meteorite-list-bounces_at_meteoritecentral.com
>[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces_at_meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Rob
>Wesel
>Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 2:38 AM
>To: Michael Farmer; meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers
>
>
>While I truly believe this practice is ultimately costly to the
>collector, truer words have never been spoken. Thanks Mike:
>
>"Virtually every dealer including myself has been or is guilty of this,

>we are in the process of correcting the situation and to start people
>MUST immediately comply or this will just spiral downward as we see
>tonight."
>
>So, for now, we make it right. We follow the rules and pay out to prove
>pairings. We wait longer to get to market and costs go up because
repeat
>lab
>fees and repeat type specimens factor into prices per gram. I don't
like
>it
>one bit but that's what we do. I will be finishing off my "likely
>paired"
>howardite as such but new specimens are already off to the lab,
>specimens I
>know are paired.
>While I seriously doubt the law has any holding here, the NomCom asks
>this
>of us. Bottom line, if two folks buy bread from the same
baker...they're
>
>eating the same bread. The full weight of this ruling will soon be felt

>by all as we bog down institutions who want to study meteorites with
>incessant
>pairings, not much grant money in pairings, not much recognition. But
>this
>is what we do...for now.
>
>Rob Wesel
>------------------
>We are the music makers...
>and we are the dreamers of the dreams.
>Willy Wonka, 1971
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net>
>To: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
>Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 7:56 PM
>Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers
>
>
>
>
>>To clarify something that is obviously causing some problems in the
>>meteorite world right now, I want everyone to know that NWA 788, 787,
>>and NWA 482 are numbers that came from rather large or meteorites with

>>hundreds of pieces bought during one of my
>>
>>
>expeditions.
>
>
>>The Hupes and many other people have the right to those numbers. Now,
>>there are other numbers being widely used without proper title
>>
>>
>(as Dr
>
>
>>Grossman has stated publicly and with finality that people do not own
>>numbers, but numbers are assigned to specific meteorite specimens and
>>
>>
>must
>
>
>>not be used with other meteorites just because you heard or someone
>>
>>
>told
>
>
>>you it is the same).
>>Let's all please stop this practice as it is really hurting our
>>
>>
>business
>
>
>>and hobby. Virtually every dealer including myself has been or is
>>
>>
>guilty
>
>
>>of this, we are in the process of correcting the situation and to
>>
>>
>start
>
>
>>people MUST immediately comply or this will just spiral downward as we
>>
>>
>see
>
>
>>tonight.
>>
>>I perused eBay today and it is still rampant with sellers using
>>numbers
>>they seem to have drawn from a hat. So please ask you seller next time
>>
>>
>you
>
>
>>buy something, how they got that number, who it was assigned to and if
>>
>>
>not
>
>
>>them, just how they came to call it that.
>>Mike Farmer
>>
>>______________________________________________
>>Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
>>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>______________________________________________
>Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
>
>______________________________________________
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>
>
>
Received on Sun 21 Nov 2004 11:47:47 AM PST


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