[meteorite-list] gao specimens and surface treatments/ oils...

From: drtanuki <drtanuki_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2007 09:47:24 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <149832.54966.qm_at_web53206.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Dear Mike and List,
  I have seen nothing but quality from you Mike and I
was not addressing your Gaos or at least did not mean
to imply anything about your Gaos.
  I even encouraged Steve publicly on the meteorite
chat list to ask you for more Gaos because I have seen
the quality and size that he wants and you have them.
  The abrasion tool that I have seen can be used to
remove soil or rust from the Gaos and other
meteorites. It is basically a sandblaster that has a
stylus like a pen. I don`t know what a "bead blaster"
is.
  Anyway I agree with Mike leave it to the buyer to
choose what he wants to buy. But as I stated as my
own personal preference...natural is best.
  Motor oil on any meteorite would not be a good idea
as it contains corrosives. Special light machine oils
(such as some sewing machine oils) can safely be used
on irons and OCs; but certainly not on any C
meteorites; and ALL oils are a no-no on anything you
want classified and should absolutely be avoided on
"new falls" (oils can and will damage very expensive
equipment and also skew analytical results; advise the
researcher as to how you cut the meteorite IF he
forget to ask; normally researchers will take some
precautions by re-cutting and cleaning with alcohol
and degassing, etc.).
  NEVER use mineral oil (baby oil) on any meteorite.
Mineral oil attracts water and will promote rusting.
I have commonly seen this used on irons and PLEASE
don`t do so.
  Enough for now. Sincerely, Dirk Ross...Tokyo


--- Michael Farmer <meteoriteguy at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Dirk, my Gao stones are cleaned with a bead blaster
> using tiny glass beads. It does not change the
> stone,
> it removes the soil which is embedded in the thick
> fusion crust on gao. I have never seen a painted
> one,
> although I did see one moron soak some in motor oil
> (the slimy exterior and smell gave that one away).
> I have nearly 40 kilograms of Gao, 90% of which is
> uncleaned, so let the buyer decide what they like,
> that is what makes the world go round.
> Michael Farmer
> --- drtanuki <drtanuki at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Dear List, Sorry this was meant for the List as
> > well
> > as Dougao.
> > >
> > > Dear Dougao and List,
> > > Doug you asked a very interesting question.
> > Many
> > > Gaos (NOT ALL) have been cleaned by using an air
> > > abrasion tool. Some even have been painted a
> nice
> > > shade of black using charcoal grill paint and
> > > others
> > > painted with an airbrush.
> > > I cannot comment on Steve`s collection as I
> > have
> > > not seen them personally. I agree with you Doug
> > > that
> > > the meteorite should not be tampered with by
> > > cleaning;
> > > but this is my/our personal preference and NOT
> > what
> > > sells. Most customers want new-looking black
> > fusion
> > > crust IF at all possible. I agree with Doug
> that
> > > Steve should add a naturally aged Gao IF he
> truly
> > > wants to represent Gao in his collection.
> > > Good job Steve; and thanks Doug for your
> > > comments!!!
> > >
> > > Sincerely, Dirk Ross...Tokyo
> > >
> > >
> > > --- MexicoDoug <MexicoDoug at aim.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi Steve and List,
> > > >
> > > > I just had a little fun browsing around your
> > > > Gao-Guenie collection pages.
> > > > It was quite enjoyable and I wanted you to
> know
> > > that
> > > > your efforts to put
> > > > together the web pages are appreciated. My
> > > favorite
> > > > photo is of the 137.5
> > > > gram specimen.
> > > >
> > > > I do have one comment where I am in
> disagreement
> > -
> > > > apparently with most of
> > > > the collecting community. That would your
> > > > preference to buy them only
> > > > "cleaned". Not having the experience with the
> > > > Gao-Guenie you have, I
> > > > wouldn't know how they are being "cleaned".
> > (And
> > > > would like to know the
> > > > whole Geschichte on "HOW NOW BROWN GAO?") But
> > it
> > > > doesn't look like it is
> > > > with a superficial passing of a clean rag.
> > While
> > > > scientifically cleaning is
> > > > generally a "no-no", in the case of
> Gao-Guenie,
> > I
> > > > doubt this is really very
> > > > crucial as there must be over a ton of this
> > > > meteorite to go around and study
> > > > for those so inclined. But this is not an
> Iron
> > > > meteorite where cleaning can
> > > > actually be important for the preservation -
> as
> > > you
> > > > mentioned, it is simply
> > > > an H5 stony chondrite.
> > > >
> > > > As the world's major Buyer of Gao-Guenie, you
> > > > actually are influencing the
> > > > major sources then to clean their specimens.
> > May
> > > I
> > > > suggest you add
> > > > uncleaned stones to your Gao Museum as well,
> for
> > > > those of us who enjoy
> > > > gawking at your world class acquisitions,
> there
> > is
> > > > something missing when we
> > > > can only see artificially spiffed up crust
> > > > everywhere when we also love to
> > > > see the meteorites more as they are found
> > in-situ.
> > >
> > > > I personally think your
> > > > collection comes up short because it is
> missing
> > a
> > > > nice, large Gao-Guenie
> > > > recently found with killer orientation
> > > > characteristics visible.
> > > >
> > > > True, when they originally fell, they were
> > rather
> > > > dark crusted, but the
> > > > stones on your page, in some cases look even
> > > darker
> > > > than the natural fresh
> > > > fusion crust color and like some NWA's that
> have
> > > > artificially sandblasted
> > > > black crusts. As I mentioned, there is enough
> > > > Gao-Guenie to go around so
> > > > there is room for both cleaned and uncleaned
> > > > specimens. But why should we
> > > > rub all of our meteorites with generic Botox
> and
> > > not
> > > > see them for the
> > > > beauties they naturally are and the way the
> > occur
> > > at
> > > > the locality? As a
> > > > collector I think careless cleaning reminds us
> > of
> > > > the the guy who finds a
> > > > cache of ancient coins and scrubs them down
> > with
> > > a
> > > > wire brush so they
> > > > glitter more than the original metal ever did.
>
> > > Can
> > > > you imagine Bob Haag
> > > > having scrubbed the Adamana Stone down to
> black?
> >
> > > I
> > > > am sure some of the
> > > > detail in the delicate flow patterns would
> have
> > > been
> > > > forever lost.
> > > >
> > > > Let's put some scientific "Witnessed" back in
> > the
> > > > fall before seeing how the
> > > > witness falls upon examination. That is my
> > > opinion
> > > > on your fantastic
> > > > collection of photos of Gao. I have a small,
> > > > natural "unclean" Gao-Guenie
> > > > specimen that is fully crusted, but it is
> > clearly
> > > > out of the major league,
> > > > so I won't bother posting it to save face and
> > not
> > > > being laughed off the
> > > > list. Nice job - I hope you consider my
> > comments
> > > > and discuss your opinion,
> > > > highly valued by dealers, regarding cleaning
> > your
> > > > Gaos.
> > > >
> > > > Best Health and Great Health,
> > > > Dougao
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "steve arnold"
> > <stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com>
> > > > To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 7:03 AM
> > > > Subject: [meteorite-list] nice gao specimens
> > only
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Hi dirk,ryan and list.No ryan I am not
> hording
> > > gao
> > > > to
> > > > > up the price per gram.LOL!!And dirk is
> > > right.Even
> > > > > though he said he had 20 kilo's of nice
> gao,I
> > > > would
> > > > > not buy it.Because at this time I could not
> > > afford
> > > > it
> > > > > all at once.I am buying nice pieces a few
> > > speimens
> > > > at
> > > > > a time.Also ryan if you noticed,I am only
> > buying
> > > > 95%
> > > > > or fusion crusted pieces.NO FRAGMENTS.NO
> > > > SLICES!Only
> > > > > really nicely cleaned pieces that look
> really
> > > well
> > > > in
> > > > > a collection.I also did not think dirk would
> > > sell
> > > > his
> > > > > anyway.He is to sly for that.And right now
> for
> > > me
> > > > gao
> > > > > is very affordable.And trust me ryan.I KNOW
> > > THERE
> > > > ARE
> > > > > MANY NICE METEORITES ARE OUT THERE.It also
> > makes
> > > > > knowing that you mostly onlt spending your
> > money
> > > > on 1
> >
> === message truncated ===
>
>
Received on Tue 27 Mar 2007 12:47:24 PM PDT