[meteorite-list] Lorton Meteorite

From: Bob Loeffler <bobl_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sun, 7 Feb 2010 12:27:04 -0700
Message-ID: <20100207192705.E343810533_at_mailwash5.pair.com>

> The doctor says he called the landlord and told him he plans to hand the
> meteorite over to the Smithsonian. He goes on to say that the landlord
> gave him PERMISSION to do so.
> I may be old school but once the landlord Ok' d the "hand over" he gave
> up ownership. Verbal agreements are legally binding. Obviously the
> landlord later realized he had made a mistake so, had his brother try to
> reclaim it but the fact is once you give something away you NO longer own
> it. Period. Sorry but please re-read this article linked here.'

Hi Carl and Phil,

Carl, you are assuming that the doctor is telling the truth. I have seen no
proof in those articles that the landlord has ever given any such
permission. He probably did, but we can't assume that just because the
doctor said so.

> When you acquire clear title to a piece of property, you
> also get landowners rights. These rights are written into
> the state constitutions or the bill of rights. You own
> everything above, below and on your land.

I'm sorry, but you are not correct, Phil. Some (many? most?) states in the
U.S. don't grant you the mineral rights under your house/business. You have
to purchase that separately (if this is allowed in your state, county or
municipality). In Colorado, you don't own the mineral rights under the
house you just bought, unless you get that specified in the title. That
wouldn't be relevant for a meteorite that just fell, but I just wanted to
make sure that everyone knows that everything below your house is not
necessarily owned by you. A friend of mine researched this 5 or so years
ago and that is what he found here in Colorado. I've heard from a few
others in other states who said the same thing.

Regards,

Bob



-----Original Message-----
From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of
cdtucson at cox.net
Sent: Sunday, February 07, 2010 11:40 AM
To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com; Phil Whitmer
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Lorton Meteorite

Phil, Martin , List,
Not to beat a dead horse here but, we all understand the way things are now.
In this link I provided earlier and again below there are particular events
that occurred that may effect the outcome of this new case.
Please read link again and click on the past precedence they link to.
One is the Pierson V. Post case. ( this is highlighted in the article) In
this case the court ruled the way most of us would expect. Surprisingly when
the ruling was challenged in the supreme court. The decision was reversed!
OMG, This case is about possession and is probably what John Lennon meant
when he said;
"Possession isn't nine-tenths of the law. It's nine-tenths of the problem.
".
Please take particular note of the boxed area which quotes the exchange
between the Doctor and his landlord.

The doctor says he called the landlord and told him he plans to hand the
meteorite over to the Smithsonian. He goes on to say that the landlord gave
him PERMISSION to do so.
I may be old school but once the landlord Ok' d the "hand over" he gave up
ownership. Verbal agreements are legally binding. Obviously the landlord
later realized he had made a mistake so, had his brother try to reclaim it
but the fact is once you give something away you NO longer own it. Period.
Sorry but please re-read this article linked here.'

http://brightcoast.wordpress.com/2010/02/05/meteorite-law-are-tenants-lost-i
n-space/

So, you see there are issues that clearly need pursuing but, Please all due
respect to Indians today but as a kid we used to call this "Indian Giving".
Sorry about that I would never use this term today but thought it would make
the point that you cannot take back something you previously gave away.
Sorry, if you are of sound mind at the time you just cannot. No matter how
bad you feel about it later. The meteorite has already changed hands. Maybe.
Only the courts can decide now.
Actually as already noted by another list member maybe they should divide it
three ways and be done with it? Carl

--
Carl or Debbie Esparza
Meteoritemax
---- Phil Whitmer <prairiecactus at rtcol.com> wrote: 
> When you acquire clear title to a piece of property, you 
> also get landowners rights.  These rights are written into 
> the state constitutions or the bill of rights.  You own
> everything above, below and on your land.  Once a 
> meteorite enters your air space, you own it. Anyone 
> who tries to take it can be charged with theft, here in 
> Indiana, felony theft.  If I was the landowner in the 
> Lorton case, I would file felony theft charges against
> whoever stole my property. 
> 
> Since there are no specific laws pertaining to meteorites,
> the courts would decide the cases by legal precedent.
> This was all worked out by the time of the  Hodges
> meteorite case in 1954. 
> 
> If you think the landowners rights are unconstitutional,
> and you want to defy precedent, lots of luck to you
> and your lawyers, as you sue for ownership of someone
> else's property.  There's no way these rules are changing
> anytime soon, especially not for meteorites. 
> 
> Phil Whitmer
> 
> 

Received on Sun 07 Feb 2010 02:27:04 PM PST