[meteorite-list] Fake moon and mars meteorite NWA's

From: info at moonmarsrocks.com <info_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Thu, 07 Jun 2012 12:07:41 -0700
Message-ID: <20120607120741.b86ea499b59be1b7298b47d2f1127a77.43c8150bfb.wbe_at_email13.secureserver.net>

Hi Mike and list,
As steelhorse1994 & spaceterrain4sale, he used Lunar NWA 4881, Lunar NWA
4734 & Martian NWA 4925. They were always packaged with the NWA lettered
on the front and American Meteorite Collectors Society called out on the
flip side. He used what I would call "commonly seen" moon or mars images
on the front AND back side.
Mike is right, some people don't want to think they were capable of
being scammed and respond negatively to the messenger. Like myself, many
of you were no doubt fascinated with space stuff as a kid, and still
are, and he sold a lot of these fakes during the 2011 Holiday season. No
doubt, there are a lot of little kids out there who don't have real
lunar or martian rocks. This is the kind of thing that makes me really
p**sed off and motivated me in this whole matter. He was clever, as they
usually are, in that he built up a top seller rating on ebay, and still
has it BTW! If you saw the recent episode of Pawn Stars, not all "silver
bars" are pure inside. Those silver bars he is selling now may be
"filled" with something not so precious.

And, yes, we need to be on the lookout for those displays resurfacing
from time to time. It is even possible he will repackage again, under a
new ebay username. Since they are fake, he could just change the NWA's
with a simple google search.

Not to worry, Mike. Since I sell legitimate displays on and off ebay, I
am ever vigilant on a weekly basis in observing any lunar or martian
material being sold on ebay.
I have to say Dr. Korotev was really accomodating, and for a person of
his stature to help out, that was fantastic. He gets a lot of email from
people with meteor-wrongs who think they have struck it rich, and he was
probably intrigue when I wrote him with the bizarro version that I was
convinced I had a fake...
Best regards,

Daniel Noyes
info at moonmarsrocks.com

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ebay victims of fake moon and mars
meteorite scam
From: Michael Gilmer <meteoritemike at gmail.com>
Date: Thu, June 07, 2012 10:56 am
To: info at moonmarsrocks.com
Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com

Hi Daniel and List,

I really feel bad for the buyers of these bogus planetaries. Things
like this damage the integrity of the entire market. In the distant
past, I used to contact sellers and buyers of questionable specimens,
but I stopped doing it long ago. First, I hate being the bearer of
ill tidings. Secondly, people like to shoot the messenger and more
than once I received hostile responses.

Now that Daniel mentions it, I do recall seeing those "titles" for
lunar real estate for sale on eBay. I had no idea it was the same
scammer who ended up selling the fake planetaries. The phrase "buyer
beware" takes on all new meaning when shopping eBay. eBay is not
going to bend over backwards to police their own marketplace because
it's not in their financial best interests. They receive revenue in
form of listing and final value fees for every item sold, regardless
of whether it is genuine or not. And they are not going to willingly
reduce their own revenue in the name of integrity. Integrity in the
corporate world went out the window back in the 1980's and it hasn't
been seen since. The only reason they have stricter controls in place
for gemstones, precious metals, Tiffany items, etc, is because those
collectibles have larger collector demographics which are very
litigious. Under the threat of lawsuits, they have tightened their
controls over certain collectibles and commodities. We will not see
the same for meteorites because we are a small (by comparison) niche

But, be careful what you wish for. If eBay were to enact tighter
controls over meteorite listings, it could be a huge hassle for many
legitimate sellers. Do we really want corporate stuffed-suits and
bureaucrats sticking their noses into the meteorite market? That
would be a double-edged sword and once that Pandora's box is opened,
there is no closing it. Is that enough cliches in one paragraph for
everyone? LOL.

>From an ethical standpoint, the best we can do is to mitigate the
damage that has been done by this bogus planetary affair. We can put
all of this out here on the record for all to see. All it takes is a
simple Google search (or Bing) to reveal the truth. Also, we must try
to remove these bogus specimens from the market as we encounter them.
The danger here is that someone will remove the bogus specimens from
their easily-identified containers and sell them in another form where
they are less easily recognized.

For the record (perhaps Daniel can help answer this), what NWA numbers
are "tainted" by these bogus displays? Luckily, the scammer appears
to have limited himself to certain NWA numbered Lunars and Martians.
These numbers must be treated with extra scrutiny from now on, until
these specimens are removed from the market.

Again, kudos to Daniel for doing the sleuth-work and Dr. Korotev for
donating his expertise.

Best regards,


Galactic Stone & Ironworks - MikeG
Web: http://www.galactic-stone.com
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
Twitter: http://twitter.com/GalacticStone
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Received on Thu 07 Jun 2012 03:07:41 PM PDT

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