[meteorite-list] Meteor crater?
From: Steve Schoner <steve_schoner_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Thu Apr 22 10:27:53 2004 Message-ID: <20031126163733.88281.qmail_at_web12706.mail.yahoo.com> --0-239476583-1069864653=:87562 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Tom, and all. Actually, according to State BLM land policy, anyone can apply for a State specimen collecting permit that allows for the collection of 250 lbs of specimens per/yr, rocks and precious metals. But what is interesting is that the State land managers will issue it for all rocks excluding meteorites. I found this out when Nininger pointed out the process to me. He stated that he had applied for it, and was denied, time and time again. For whatever reason the State of Arizona Land Department has taken it upon themselves to exclude meteorites... technically ALL meteorites, even those found at Gold Basin, Holbrook and other sites. They have not come after anyone yet... but they could if they wanted to. But as for Meteor Crater, the AZ State Land Department with the aide of MCE will put us through the threat of the "6 steps of harassment" that I previously outlined. Steve Schoner/ams (P. S. Take the risk if you like... And if you go to jail, give me a call.) Tom aka James Knudson <knudson911_at_frontiernet.net> wrote: Hello List, Just to make it clear, I am the one looking for a LEGAL place to look for CD's! I was wondering if you could find fragments under the flight path of the meteor as it came in. I wanted to see if there was any BLM land under the flight path that could be hunted. I would never hunt illegally although I do think Barringer obtained the land illegally! Even as a Christian, I hope Barringer is burning in hell! : ) Thanks, Tom Peregrineflier <>< Yea, that's right, The proudest member of the IMCA # 6168 ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Schoner To: Roman Nakonechny Cc: meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 8:21 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteor crater? Roman, Forget searching Meteor Crater... even out to distances of more than 7 miles... Bar-T-Bar (aka Meteor Crater Enterprises) controls all of the land even at that distance. And if you do expect to be harassed, by 1) Being accosted by their "security guards" sometimes dressed like State Park Rangers. (They did this to me in 1979 on State Lands several miles away from the Crater in broad daylight. They wanted to "confiscate" my detector and when they went to get a rifle from their truck to make the point I produced my pistol holster with the gun holstered, and said "Don't go there. You made your point, and you won't get my detector at gunpoint. I am leaving. But when I get to Flagstaff, I will file a police report of this incident... Which I did.) 2) All of the above, and now expect to be thrown into. A) The Winslow Jail (a very bad place) B) The Flagstaff Jail ( a better place). And expect to spend a day or two there before a hearing before a judge. 3) Charges will be filed against you for "criminal trespass" and "meteorite poaching" on State and Private lands. 4) A trial date will be set and you will be released, sans your detector and any meteorites you might have found, and you will have to hire a lawyer and pay him good money to defend yourself.. 5) A court case will be initiated where you will have to appear at least once or several times. 6) And after you have expended a considerable amount of money, and time, Bar-T-Bar (aka Meteor Crater Enterprises) and or the AZ State Land Department will drop the charges after they have made the point. (I know of no case that they have prosecuted to the finish... They drop their cases every time.) 7) Before you consider going through all of the above, you might just go to Stewarts outside of Holbrook and look at and buy some of their very large Canyon Diablo's . They range from grams to 50 lbs. Beautiful specimens, all fresh dug. (I wonder who it is that has "Meteor Crater" permission to market them through Stewarts, so as to avoid the first 6 things that I outlined above. It is a question that I have had for quite some time. Stewarts, won't say.) Steve Schoner/ams P.S. You are right about the science at Meteor Crater. With the exception of Dr. Shoemaker's work in the late 1950's and that of Dr. Roddy... NO SIGNIFICANT SCIENCE HAS BEEN DONE OUT THERE. Why? Because according to the managers..."All the science that needs to have been done has already been done." Period. (There are two well known meteorite dealers here on MetList that can elucidate on their experiences out there on those public lands. Find out the what happened to them, and the legal harassing that they went through. It is an eye opener. I could provide their names off list and you can e-mail them directly) Sorry for "ranting" but the Meteor Crater situation does tick me off. Steve Schoner/ams http://www.geocities.com/american_meteorite_survey --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now --0-239476583-1069864653=:87562 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii <DIV> <DIV>Tom, and all.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Actually, according to State BLM land policy, anyone can apply for a State specimen collecting permit that allows for the collection of 250 lbs of specimens per/yr, rocks and precious metals.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But what is interesting is that the State land managers will issue it for all rocks excluding meteorites. I found this out when Nininger pointed out the process to me. He stated that he had applied for it, and was denied, time and time again.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>For whatever reason the State of Arizona Land Department has taken it upon themselves to exclude meteorites... technically ALL meteorites, even those found at Gold Basin, Holbrook and other sites. They have not come after anyone yet... but they could if they wanted to. </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>But as for Meteor Crater, the AZ State Land Department with the aide of MCE will put us through the threat of the "6 steps of harassment" that I previously outlined.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Steve Schoner/ams </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>(P. S. Take the risk if you like... And if you go to jail, give me a call.)</DIV> <DIV><BR><BR><B><I>Tom aka James Knudson <knudson911_at_frontiernet.net></I></B> wrote:</DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #1010ff 2px solid"> <META content="MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> <DIV><FONT size=2> <DIV><FONT size=2>Hello List, Just to make it clear, I am the one looking for a LEGAL place to look for CD's! I was wondering if you could find fragments under the flight path of the meteor as it came in. I wanted to see if there was any BLM land under the flight path that could be hunted. I would never hunt illegally although I do think Barringer obtained the land illegally! Even as a Christian, I hope Barringer is burning in hell! : ) </FONT></DIV> <DIV></FONT>Thanks, Tom<BR>Peregrineflier <><<BR>Yea, that's right,<BR>The proudest member of the IMCA # 6168</DIV></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=steve_schoner_at_yahoo.com href="mailto:steve_schoner@yahoo.com">Steve Schoner</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=uraninut239__at_hotmail.com href="mailto:uraninut239_@hotmail.com">Roman Nakonechny</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com href="mailto:meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com">meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, November 26, 2003 8:21 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [meteorite-list] Meteor crater?</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV> <DIV>Roman,</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Forget searching Meteor Crater... even out to distances of more than 7 miles... Bar-T-Bar (aka Meteor Crater Enterprises) controls all of the land even at that distance.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>And if you do expect to be harassed, by</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>1) Being accosted by their "security guards" sometimes dressed like State Park Rangers. (They did this to me in 1979 on State Lands several miles away from the Crater in broad daylight. They wanted to "confiscate" my detector and when they went to get a rifle from their truck to make the point I produced my pistol holster with the gun holstered, and said "Don't go there. You made your point, and you won't get my detector at gunpoint. I am leaving. But when I get to Flagstaff, I will file a police report of this incident... Which I did.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>2) All of the above, and now expect to be thrown into. A) The Winslow Jail (a very bad place) B) The Flagstaff Jail ( a better place). And expect to spend a day or two there before a hearing before a judge.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>3) Charges will be filed against you for "criminal trespass" and "meteorite poaching" on State and Private lands.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>4) A trial date will be set and you will be released, sans your detector and any meteorites you might have found, and you will have to hire a lawyer and pay him good money to defend yourself..</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>5) A court case will be initiated where you will have to appear at least once or several times.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>6) And after you have expended a considerable amount of money, and time, Bar-T-Bar (aka Meteor Crater Enterprises) and or the AZ State Land Department will drop the charges after they have made the point. (I know of no case that they have prosecuted to the finish... They drop their cases every time.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>7) Before you consider going through all of the above, you might just go to Stewarts outside of Holbrook and look at and buy some of their very large Canyon Diablo's . They range from grams to 50 lbs. Beautiful specimens, all fresh dug. (I wonder who it is that has "Meteor Crater" permission to market them through Stewarts, so as to avoid the first 6 things that I outlined above. It is a question that I have had for quite some time. Stewarts, won't say.)</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Steve Schoner/ams</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>P.S. You are right about the science at Meteor Crater. With the exception of Dr. Shoemaker's work in the late 1950's and that of Dr. Roddy... NO SIGNIFICANT SCIENCE HAS BEEN DONE OUT THERE. Why? Because according to the managers..."All the science that needs to have been done has already been done."</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Period.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV>(There are two well known meteorite dealers here on MetList that can elucidate on their experiences out there on those public lands. Find out the what happened to them, and the legal harassing that they went through. It is an eye opener. I could provide their names off list and you can e-mail them directly)</DIV></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Sorry for "ranting" but the Meteor Crater situation does tick me off.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Steve Schoner/ams</DIV> <DIV><A href="http://www.geocities.com/american_meteorite_survey">http://www.geocities.com/american_meteorite_survey</A></DIV> <DIV><BR><BR> </DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><p><hr SIZE=1> Do you Yahoo!?<br> <a href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/slv/mailtag/*http://companion.yahoo.com/">Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now</a> --0-239476583-1069864653=:87562-- Received on Wed 26 Nov 2003 11:37:33 AM PST |
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