[meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?

From: Michael Farmer <meteoritehunter_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue Aug 24 18:00:29 2004
Message-ID: <003c01c48a20$1b7f2340$0200a8c0_at_S0031628003>

WOW, Adam, you had the chance to apologize, and you didn't.
Again, you just made false charges about me, saying that I stole meteorites
from Australia.
Now Adam, I think everyone on this list can see that since you did not
present any proof in your email.
For you information, I found many kilos of Mundrabilla, it is sitting in
Australia at this time awaiting Export permit, and god willing, if it comes
through in time, it will be brought to Denver by a friend of mine down
there. See Adam, it isn't really that sinister, Mundrabilla is not hard to
get export permits for.
If you are suggesting that the fact that I updated my boring plain-jane
mundrabilla eBay pages with classy new photos from the strewnfield proves
that I smuggled out meteorites, again, you are sorely mistaken. I have been
buying Mundrabilla for many years, before you know what a meteorite was, and
I do believe that my new eBay page is much better now with actual photos
from the strewnfield. I have many kilos that I bought in the last years, Bob
Haag has many kilos sitting in his basement, Peter Heidelar has many kilos
for sale every year in Tucson (who I buy most of it from).
 Now, to the Shale auctions, indeed, I brought back a couple kilos of
Meteorite Shale. The Australian Cultural affairs person said that shale is
considered "Rust" which is basically is, and Rust is not covered or
considered a meteorite, and I could take all of the meteorite RUST out of
Australia that I wanted to. Which I did.

Adam, you have a track record of slamming everyone and anyone who sells
something that you have and don't have.

Now, do not ever accuse me of stealing meteorites from Australia or anywhere
else unless you have proof to share, no proof means you had better not
accuse me.
I am disappointed in you, and I am sure most of the list is.
You accused me, making false statements when you have no goddmaned idea what
I did in Australia.
Get a life Adam, and quit pretending to be a scientist, you are not and
never will be. People are tiring of your old "we do it for the science"
spiel. your hundreds of eBay auctions prove otherwise.

You are the one who made this ugly, so apologize and it can all be over.

I will not be called a criminal and keep my mouth shut.

Does anyone on this list think that I should not defend myself to the
absolute bullshit charges Adam made? He was not in Australia, I just got
home, I have talked to about 5 people regarding my trip, do any of you
belive that Adam has some spyplane following me 1000 miles into the desert?
Adam, where do you get your data about my trip to Australia?

Michael Farmer
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>
To: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net>
Cc: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?


> Hello again Mike and List,
>
> Are you saying you left those Mundrabillas behind that you imaged in situ
> and that you did not illegally remove material from India? Mike, a smart
> thing for you to do is stay out of controversies as you clearly take each
> and every one of them personally, something a guilty person would do. The
> anonymous parties did leave references behind and were fairly thorough
about
> the Mountain finds being a myth.
>
> Since this string is headed in an unexpected direction and is turning ugly
I
> will step out.
>
> Adam
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net>
> To: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>
> Cc: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 12:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?
>
>
> > EXCUSE ME, Australia? what do you know about my trip to Australia? What
do
> > you know ADAM? TELL US ALL Now since you just accused me of committing a
> > crime. This is beyond reproach. Again, what might I ask do you know
about
> my
> > trip to Australia.
> > Adam, this is not acceptible. How dare you, were you there? Do you know
> what
> > I did? Do you PRETEND to know what I brought back from Australia? DO
YOU?
> > And might We all ask, HOW do you know such thing, when I have been home
> all
> > of 3 days?
> > Adam, moment of truth like Dumbya had yesterday, tell us how you know
> > something about my Australia trip? Ill bet you that you dont.
> > Michael Farmer
> > One pissed off guy right now.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>
> > To: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net>
> > Cc: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 11:54 AM
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?
> >
> >
> > > Hi Mike and List,
> > >
> > > The Campo thing has being going on for years and I thought it was time
> to
> > > clarify things because I was considering going there. I respect the
> laws
> > > governing meteorites and no I am not sitting a load of Campo. What I
> have
> > > in my inventory amounts to less than half a kilo. To be honest, I do
> not
> > > know its legal status because it was purchased at auction in Tucson.
> Mike
> > > just because you do not care about laws as your past record
demonstrates
> > in
> > > India and now Australia is no reason for you to jump to conclusions
> > > regarding my status.
> > >
> > > All the best,
> > >
> > > Adam
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net>
> > > To: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>; "dean bessey"
> > > <deanbessey_at_yahoo.com>
> > > Cc: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 11:55 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?
> > >
> > >
> > > > Are you joking Adam? Why do you keep making these weird
controversies
> up
> > > > every week? I saw the Amgala one come up out of the blue, now this?
> As
> > a
> > > > person who has sold literally TONS of campo, I don't know of any
> > > > controversy, and till your email, never saw any on this list for at
> > least
> > > 4
> > > > or 5 years.
> > > > So why did this start up all of a sudden? Are you getting ready to
> start
> > > > selling them, prepping the market for your "legal Campos" while
> everyone
> > > > else sells "Stolen Campos"?
> > > >
> > > > I just find this non-existent controversy to be complete idiocy, and
> > these
> > > > "sources who want to remain anonymous" give me a break.
> > > >
> > > > Why start this up out of the blue for no reason? Why start an
> argument
> > > > where there was none?
> > > > My two cents.
> > > > Michael Farmer
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>
> > > > To: "dean bessey" <deanbessey_at_yahoo.com>
> > > > Cc: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 11:41 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Hi Dean and List,
> > > > >
> > > > > The anonymous people you are talking about wish to remain so
because
> > of
> > > > the
> > > > > controversy surrounding Campos. The List can become a
battleground
> > and
> > > > they
> > > > > do not want to take part in the fray. This does not make them
weak,
> > just
> > > > > responsible. They, none the less, felt it was important to share
> this
> > > > > information. One of the sources is a well known scientist, another
> is
> > an
> > > > > author on the subject and the third is a respected List member.
Do
> > not
> > > > > forget that a great deal of respectable people follow the List,
> choose
> > > not
> > > > > to share and understandably want to stay out of controversial
> subjects
> > > > > because of their careers.
> > > > >
> > > > > All the best,
> > > > >
> > > > > Adam
> > > > >
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "dean bessey" <deanbessey_at_yahoo.com>
> > > > > To: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 11:15 AM
> > > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > I wouldent trust some "Unknown annoyonamous" source.
> > > > > > Lets see that stand up in court or argue it at
> > > > > > customs.
> > > > > > It is pretty easy to read a law and pretty easy to get
> > > > > > a copy of any law in argentina (Just ask the embassy).
> > > > > > You might need somebody to translate it to english but
> > > > > > anybody who is making a blind statement of fact and
> > > > > > being to pussy scared into mentioning their names
> > > > > > sounds to me more likely sombody trying to privately
> > > > > > scare you away from looking over their strewnfield.
> > > > > > Sort of reminds me of Keith Littleton's rant last June
> > > > > > on this list where he went to some serious
> > > > > > archaeologists and deliberately misrepresented one of
> > > > > > Mark Bostics auctions of Libyan Desert Glass as some
> > > > > > ancient egyptian artifact and then from the responce
> > > > > > concerning ancient artifacts declared that it was
> > > > > > illegal to export unworked pieces of libyan desert
> > > > > > glass.
> > > > > > It makes no sense to me why somebody without any
> > > > > > ulterior motive would make the declarations that they
> > > > > > made to Adam and then request that they remain
> > > > > > annonamous. If you contact the embassy they wont tell
> > > > > > you to "Not tell anybody that you got this copy of
> > > > > > argentnian laws from us".
> > > > > > There was a new world wide law passed lately. Only the
> > > > > > pellisons are permitted to deal in meteorites.
> > > > > > Everybody else by decree are not allowed to deal in
> > > > > > meteorites.
> > > > > > The pellisons have told everybody this but we are not
> > > > > > sure what authority issued it. Seems only the
> > > > > > pellisons know.
> > > > > > These "annonumous" sources have about as much
> > > > > > credibility as keith and the Pellisons rants over the
> > > > > > past few years.
> > > > > > Maybe its just me. But somehow it just seems odd to me
> > > > > > that an intelligent and sane person and serious
> > > > > > meteorite hunter would plan trips around some
> > > > > > annonomous individual sending them an email saying
> > > > > > that something is illegal so stay away rather than
> > > > > > making a quick phone call to the countries embassy. I
> > > > > > have a friend who is trying to get twenty two million
> > > > > > dollars out of Nigeria. I know this to be true because
> > > > > > he contacted me out of the blue via email from some
> > > > > > internet cafe last night. Maybe I should put him in
> > > > > > touch with any list member interested in helping him
> > > > > > out. Just dont call the nigerian embassy to find out
> > > > > > the exact law concerning this activity.
> > > > > > Sincerely
> > > > > > DEAN
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > .
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- Adam Hupe <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Dear List,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I would like to thank those who responded to my
> > > > > > > inquiry about old versus new
> > > > > > > Campos. I am looking to explore new areas and
> > > > > > > thought this locality might
> > > > > > > have been worth investigating but have since changed
> > > > > > > my mind. Below are a
> > > > > > > set of responses that best address this issue. The
> > > > > > > authors would like to
> > > > > > > remain anonymous so I left their names out.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ***********************************************
> > > > > > > Email #1
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Your "well informed source" is correct on both
> > > > > > > counts. Illegal exportation
> > > > > > > and there are no mountainside finds. The terrain is
> > > > > > > basically flat and the
> > > > > > > strewn field is shorter and wider than presented in
> > > > > > > Cassiday's various
> > > > > > > papers. The reports of a specimen recovery 70-80 km
> > > > > > > down-range are repeated,
> > > > > > > but have never been evidenced. The difference
> > > > > > > between 'new' and 'old' Campos
> > > > > > > is the depth of recovery. Cassiday's specimens
> > > > > > > recovered 1962-73 are both
> > > > > > > 'new' and 'old'. Recovered at depth within the
> > > > > > > craters are 'new'; those
> > > > > > > recovered from surface ejecta or from farmers'
> > > > > > > fields are 'old'. Repeated
> > > > > > > irrigation and the use of fertilizers has taken its
> > > > > > > toll. Cassiday used a
> > > > > > > WW2 metal detector in his search. With the
> > > > > > > increasing demand by collectors -
> > > > > > > beginning about 1989 - much more powerful detectors
> > > > > > > are being used in
> > > > > > > recovery; the deeper recoveries being more stable.
> > > > > > > Not all of the 'new'
> > > > > > > specimens are stable as some specimens continue to
> > > > > > > be found at shallow
> > > > > > > depths. The extremely flat surface of the region is
> > > > > > > subject to sheet
> > > > > > > deposition 1-2 cm/100 yr (think Kansas). Runoff is
> > > > > > > limited to shallow
> > > > > > > depressions and occasional shallow channels; the
> > > > > > > slopes of which might be
> > > > > > > miss translated as mountain-sides.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The pre-entry meteoroid is estimated to be ~ 3 m in
> > > > > > > diameter and masses ~
> > > > > > > 840,000 kg (Lieberman, et al., in MAPS Feb 2002) and
> > > > > > > suggests that many more
> > > > > > > specimens will be smuggled out in the coming years.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Other than the variously published photos by Cassidy
> > > > > > > et, al. I was only able
> > > > > > > to locate photos of the "Haag" specimen. Its
> > > > > > > recovery down-range is
> > > > > > > consistent with aerial break-up scenarios and is
> > > > > > > probably the Campo del
> > > > > > > Cielo main mass.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ****************************************************
> > > > > > > Another Note:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The place where the "New Campos" are found is the
> > > > > > > same that the one of the
> > > > > > > "Old Campos". The difference is the "old" are near
> > > > > > > the surface, so them
> > > > > > > intensely undergone the effects of the
> > > > > > > meteorization, mainly the humidity.
> > > > > > > The "new" are deeper so that them could conserve its
> > > > > > > regmagliptes and have a
> > > > > > > greater stability. The "New Campos" began to appear
> > > > > > > when the zone was
> > > > > > > released with powerful metal detectors. Previously
> > > > > > > the espec?mentes were
> > > > > > > found on the surface or raised when the fields were
> > > > > > > plowed.
> > > > > > > The Campo del Cielo strewn field has 45km by 15km.
> > > > > > > But it has an area of
> > > > > > > approximately 1500 hectares where the greater
> > > > > > > concentration is verified.
> > > > > > > Many authors affirm that the strewn field reaches 80
> > > > > > > km, because stories
> > > > > > > exist on the denominated "Mes?n de Fierro", probably
> > > > > > > situated 70 km to the
> > > > > > > NE of the main site. But until today it was not
> > > > > > > verified.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > *******************************************************
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I hope you found this information to be as
> > > > > > > interesting as I did,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Adam
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ______________________________________________
> > > > > > > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > > > > > > Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________
> > > > > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > > > > Win 1 of 4,000 free domain names from Yahoo! Enter now.
> > > > > > http://promotions.yahoo.com/goldrush
> > > > > > ______________________________________________
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> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ______________________________________________
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> >
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>
>
Received on Tue 24 Aug 2004 05:19:55 PM PDT


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