[meteorite-list] Need a meteorite picture repository (was Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records)

From: Bob Loeffler <bobl_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 09:14:27 -0700
Message-ID: <20081226161427.CC73D1053D_at_mailwash5.pair.com>

Hi all,

I'm not posting this to MikeG's chat group discussion because my idea is not
the focus of that discussion.

I see only one thing missing from this Meteorite list: A picture repository
for list members who don't have websites. We can have all of the
meteorite-related discussions that we so desire on this list, but if a
member wants to show us pictures of his meteorites, he/she has to use a
service like Flickr if he/she doesn't have his/her own website. Flickr and
some of the others are nice for general use, but then we have pictures
strewn about all over the web and it's impossible to search for them. Not
easy for new members (or old members) to view them.

What I would like to see is a meteor/meteorite picture storage site that is
easy to navigate and easy for people to post their pictures to. It would
need to be moderated (e.g. someone posts a picture and caption, then the
moderator would need to OK it before it is viewable by everyone) and you
would need to be a "member" of the website (free, of course, but donations
would be good) to be able to post (so it would cut down on "spammer posts").
The moderator would then prevent the few spammer posts to be uploaded. Each
member would get his/her own folder (or album) to post pictures into. And
maybe they could create more folders within their main folder. It would
need to be searchable (e.g. I want to see all Sikhote Alin meteorites).

Anyone could become a member, even dealers who already have a website,
because they might want to share their personal collection with everyone
else without putting it on their dealer website. There would be no
advertising on this, but you could add your website URL to the caption of a
picture if you want people to be able to easily find your website. There
would be NO discussion on the website since we already have a place for
that. :-) Just pictures and their captions.

It should be able to have it's own website domain name (e.g.
www.met-list-meteorites.com). I volunteer to pay the yearly domain name fee
if others would share the monthly web hosting fee (I could help with that,
too) and the daily work. I am too stretched on other volunteer work, so I
can't do much of the daily moderation (which of course could be done every
couple of days instead of daily).

Is there any website system out there that can do this already? Or is there
anyone who could make one?

Thanks and Happy Holidays!

Regards,

Bob Loeffler
COMETS
http://www.peaktopeak.com/comets/


-----Original Message-----
From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of John
higgins
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 8:08 AM
To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records

?Hi Elton, this post is not in any way intended to be? a attack, trolling,
disparagement, of you or anyone else who feels the same way. And the
meteorite working group, would perfer this conversation be OFF-LIST. We
don't want this to be a meteorite list issue! Instead of discouraging other
people, which you have obvisouly acclompished with flying colors. Come and
join in our discussion. Get to know the people you are calling untalented
auto salesman, and see if when you are done you still think of us as
selfish, greedy self centered folks, who only have their own self intrest at
heart. A dicussion is all it is at this point. If the idea gets far, and you
still disagree. Then bash it all you want. Our group already stated that we
want a private dicussion, you are trying to bash us in a public forum, not
very nice. Maybe somebody can make comments on your moral judgement and
nature for doing so, but that is not in our nature, so we cannot comment on
 that. I have already responded to your post in Mike's yahoo chat group.
Anybody who is intrested, should go there and comment. You can find my post
as well as others at http://groups.yahoo.com/group/meteoriteworkinggroup/
Have a Great Day!
John Higgins



----- Original Message ----
From: Mr EMan <mstreman53 at yahoo.com>
To: valparint at aol.com; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:47:31 AM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records

Hello Folks--? Season's greetings. I just wanted to share some thoughts on?
forming new meteorite interest groups--past empire building in the meteorite
world in general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no one take
this as an attack, trolling,disparagement, discouragement, or a "dissing" of
anyone.? It is not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to
the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea was proposed and I am
not per se addressing his proposal in any way so please keep an open mind.?
On this list we are as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a
collection of members within the existing meteorite interest niches.? As a
long time member? with observations regarding "empire building" as an
alternative to the Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space,
IMCA, etc.? there have been a plenty.? I could list a long string of people
who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to
 improve/perfect the
culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of -- or because of--self
caused blunders, there were many patient old timers willing to? advise them
on how to get oriented to the list rather than making the list fit around
them.? They tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the
technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite culture often being
rebuffed, accused of trying to squash competition, or rejected as not
knowing what they were talking about.? What was hard for some? novices to
accept was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable to make
inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker.? There were many more
that took the help and are strong respected contributors today.

Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members stepped aside,
letting them fall into craters of their own making--some many times over.?
Many, many, times we have seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to
provide? "alternatives
" to the meteorite forum communities.? For the majority of those past
forums, I'd have to look hard to see if they were still around.? Some were
more noble than others.? There were some who spend a lot of effort making
dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem.? When the dust
settled they sat wondering what went wrong and why their enterprise/forum/
efforts failed to hold attention.?

Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest groups/ mailing lists:
some active but with only duplicate postings, some are inactive/abandoned
with only newbie postings who never bothered to look at the membership
numbers or posting activity,? some private technical lists which are by
invitation only, and of course-- the dealer's own list where ads go directly
to the member.? For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99%
of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken and are being
served well by the host. There is a saturation point and economy-of-scale
even in this field of interest.? In the words of a frequent poster "it is a
free county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the groups or forums
they wish--the Internet is a very large place.? Those that offer a truly
unique and desirable service will last and those that are offering another
way to slice up the limited pie won't--? and will end up on the ash
 pile
of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that did succeed, did so
by offering real value and in an unselfish manner within many many manhours
and personal expense to do so.

What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't succeed: those who rely
too much on assumptions, those that don't take a thoughtful look at the true
market for their service, those that overestimate their expertise and time
committment, those that don't attempt a basic understanding of the meteorite
science to understand the commodity.? Basically those who arrive thinking
their personal marketing talents will overcome technical, knowledge, and
cultural issues-- don't last over the long haul.? Perhaps potential members
are jaded by all the flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to accept
those proven members only after a long time of watching how they behave.? I
don't know of any shortcut to this period of watching and slowly winning
people over.

This community isn't a automobile dealership, it isn't a church, it isn't
the Elks, it isn't a group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a
field where you are known by your reputation--reputation means everything to
the majority of people.? You can't forge (as in fake ) those credentials ;
you have to forge them (as in earn them) by hard work over time.? That seems
to be the final obstacle to work through by those offering an alternative
folks are willing sign up for.? I've probably been ignored, filtered, and
moderated over the years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I
know much of the list from both sides.? I do wish any and everyone who is
willing to go it for the long haul the best of success. If you promote it
for the love of meteorites instead the love of self then you'll have a
better shot at long term success.

Elton
Received on Fri 26 Dec 2008 11:14:27 AM PST