[meteorite-list] Fw: Request > Glorieta Mountain strewnfield map

From: Greg Catterton <star_wars_collector_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 15:01:49 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <235878.33747.qm_at_web46404.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

I just wanted to chime in on this for a moment.

I made the error of questioning Jacks motives soon after the recovery of the Whetstone fall. No need to rehash the reasons, but yet I feel is more important to voice my thoughts in hindsight. (we all know its 20/20)

I was lucky enough to meet Jack and talk to him some at the MAG meeting recently.
Even after my initial post way back when the recovery was announced (our first "interaction") Jack was very kind and polite and showed me and my family a great deal of respect and kindness. He even signed a book for me and also my daughter.
It is my opinion that Jack is a first class guy who did an outstanding job with the documentation and recording of the very historic Whetstone fall.

Any question of his ethics and intentions is unwarranted.
To hear him talk about the fall and recovery, to see his excitement firsthand as he reminisced about the fall and what he felt was important (he mentioned several times about his son and studies with meteorites and just how much he wanted him to be able to find one) honestly showed just where his heart was.

Jack deserved to find this fall, it was meant for him to, and I for one am happy for him that he did. The way the recovery was documented by Jack and Dave also shows the importance of recording strong data and should be a benchmark for future recovery efforts by all.

Just my thoughts, Hope everyone is well.


Greg Catterton
www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com
IMCA member 4682
On Ebay: http://stores.shop.ebay.com/wanderingstarmeteorites


--- On Tue, 3/9/10, Jack Schrader <schraderj at rocketmail.com> wrote:

> From: Jack Schrader <schraderj at rocketmail.com>
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Fw: Request > Glorieta Mountain strewnfield map
> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Date: Tuesday, March 9, 2010, 5:28 PM
> Carl,
> ???? Since you posted your comment to the list in
> regards to myself and my son, I am going to comment openly
> on this list in reply.? The University of Arizona was
> immediately supplied with the coordinates of the Whetstone
> Mountains area fall.? The U of A would not classify the
> sample of WM without the coordinates, nor could the
> meteorite be officially recognized by the Meteoritical
> Society without the exact coordinates.? The coordinates
> were withheld as a courtesy to allow for the proper mapping
> of the strewnfield.? Apparently, the Meteoritical Society
> and the University of Arizona find the data not only useful
> but very valuable as well.
> ???? I take great exception to your implications in
> your post that I received favored treatment from the U of A
> because my son is a graduate student there.? Great
> exception to your ignorant comment!? I am actually fuming
> at the moment!? My son Devin had absolutely nothing to do
> with the classification of the meteorite or the fact that
> the classification was accepted by the U of A and
> accomplished so quickly.? The University of Arizona
> accepted this for classification due solely to the fact that
> it was the first Arizona fall recovered in 97 years and was
> recovered in their own back yard.? It had nothing to do
> with my son or "who you know".? The fall was historic and
> important to my Alma Mater, the University of Arizona.? If
> you do not know what you are talking about, then I suggest
> you keep your mouth shut.? You owe my son Devin and myself
> an apology for your ignorant and uncalled for comments.
>
> Dr.?Jack L. Schrader?
>
>
>
> ----- Forwarded Message ----
> From: "cdtucson at cox.net"
> <cdtucson at cox.net>
> To: meteoritefinder at yahoo.com;
> jgrossman at usgs.gov;
> Greg Stanley <stanleygregr at hotmail.com>
> Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Tue, March 9, 2010 3:04:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Request > Glorieta
> Mountain strewnfield map
>
> Greg,
> I'm not saying they are useless. I am just saying for
> scientific knowledge they are not all that important.
> I'm just saying that I don't like having my new find
> classification held up because I don't want to share co-ords
> at this time. that's all. Although depending on who you are
> you may be able to get it done without co-ords. If you are
> say, someone named Jack? and your son works at U of A
> Planetary sciences perhaps? Nothing personal here but as
> always it's who you know I guess. sorry.
> And by the way. I don't remember where I found that
> beautiful blood red ruby. Why do you ask? If I happen to
> remember, you will be the first to know. NOT!
> --
> Carl or Debbie Esparza
> Meteoritemax
>
>
> ---- Greg Stanley <stanleygregr at hotmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > What if the Brenham meteorite never was documented.?
> Perhaps Steve Arnold would have never found his huge
> meteorite a few years back.? Never developed his searching
> technique and thus perhaps no "Meteorite Men."
> >
> > Just imagine if a friend came home and showed you a
> beautiful blood red ruby (gem quality) the size of a
> baseball, and you asked "where did you find that?" and he
> replied "I don't know."
> >
> > The more all work together, the more we all benefit
> and our children benefit.
> >
> > Greg S.
> >
> > ----------------------------------------
> > > Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 15:33:32 -0500
> > > From: cdtucson at cox.net
> > > To: meteoritefinder at yahoo.com;
> jgrossman at usgs.gov
> > > CC: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Request>
> Glorieta Mountain strewnfield map
> > >
> > > Robert,
> > > I couldn't agree with you more here about Jeff.
> > > He is in my opinion THE most important person on
> this list. period. Not because I agree with him all of the
> time but because he always has THE RIGHT THING TO SAY. Which
> puts him head and shoulders above most of us and especially
> above me.
> > > Having said that. I don't yet understand why
> people put so much importance on find co-ords and
> strewnfields. It has not only been pointed out by another
> important list member that "A meteorite does not care where
> it lands". (Ted Bunch). But to add to that I personally
> don't see where it will ever matter all that much. I mean it
> has been pointed out that;
> > > 1). These rocks move around and therefore do not
> tell us anything about where they landed. The wind , water,
> flood, erosion. What ever the reason these things move
> around.
> > > 2). They are not a geological formation. They
> land totally randomly. This is therefore trivial information
> ( of very little value).
> > > 3). Larger material falls farthest? Yes, and
> littler one ride piggy back with the big ones which skews
> the pattern and we may never know it because The bigger ones
> may bury themselves never to be found. So, what have we
> learned from something never found?
> > > 4). How much more can we expect to learn from
> strewnfields? Ask any third grader to show you what rocks do
> when they fall from any angle.
> > > 5). This is really very simple stuff. The science
> is in the rest of the knowledge we can gain. Let this
> co-ords and strewnfield crap go and things will get a lot
> simpler.
> > > 6). This will eliminate the need for certain
> laws. Nobody will care where it landed and therefore less
> court battles over something that wouldn't exist if not for
> an informed finder anyway.
> > > 7). Did I mention beating a dead horse?
> > > 8). I am sure I did not think of all the bad
> reasons for mapping here . Give me time.
> > > 9). I understand in the past we needed data on
> this but we are past the invention of the wheel. Time to
> move forward.
> > > But Jeff, other than that we all love you. Well
> at least like you a bunch.
> > > Carl
> > > --
> > > Carl or Debbie Esparza
> > > Meteoritemax
> > >
> > >
> > > ---- Robert Woolard? wrote:
> > >> Jeff,
> > >>
> > >> You wrote in part:
> > >> "A good policy would continue to reward
> those
> > >>> who find these objects on behalf of the
> people, but also
> > >>> prevent the loss of scientific
> information and significant
> > >>> specimens.
> > >>>
> > >>> The question becomes, how can a
> reasonable regulation and
> > >>> permitting process be created? I'll
> discuss this with
> > >>> my colleagues in DOI and the SI, and
> perhaps groups like the
> > >>> IMCA can help lobby for this as well. I
> think it is
> > >>> quite achievable."
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> THANK you so much for your very intelligent
> and logical input. You are exactly the kind of
> "scientist/human being" ;-) we need! We are lucky to have
> someone like you as a member of The List. I'm sure we all
> greatly appreciate your willingness to help in this matter.
> > >>
> > >> Sincerely,
> > >> Robert Woolard
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> ______________________________________________
> > >> Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> > >> Meteorite-list mailing list
> > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> > > ______________________________________________
> > > Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> > > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> > > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >? ??? ??? ??? ? ??? ??? ?
> >
> _________________________________________________________________
> > Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469228/direct/01/
>
> ______________________________________________
> Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
>
>
> ? ? ?
> ______________________________________________
> Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>


      
Received on Tue 09 Mar 2010 06:01:49 PM PST