[meteorite-list] Pronouncing Willamette and other meteorite names

From: Darren Garrison <cynapse_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Wed, 23 Apr 2008 11:16:37 -0400
Message-ID: <o5iu04hjonp883inq7q3i6ipt4dfenng32_at_4ax.com>

On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 02:45:25 -0700, you wrote:

> As for Allende, someone said there is nothing wrong
>With "Anglicizing" a word....You would have a VERY
>Difficult time living in So. CA - going to El Cajon (el ca hone)
>And La Jolla (la hoy ya) etc. Even in LA, they pronounce
>It "row DAY oh" Drive, not rodeo drive, as it was the Spanish
>Name place originally.

You can pick and choose names that keep their original pronounciation if you
want. But you can also pick and choose names that have been Anglicized if you
want. The point is, if a word LOOKS like it follows the spelling of a
"traditional" English word-- unless you have evidence otherwise-- you will
usually try to pronounce it as if it were a "traditional" English word (and the
same goes for non-English speakers, of course-- if the word LOOKS to fit the
conventions of your languge, I'll bet that, with no instruction otherwise,
you'll try to pronounce it according to the conventions of your language). Your
examples "El Cajon" and "La Jolla" look obviously Spanish and not English. But
"Allende" looks like a perfectly cromulent English word-- you have, Allentown,
PA, for example, not Ayantown, PA. So "Allende" just didn't trigger an alarm in
my head to pronounce it differently-- I wasn't being contrary, it simply never
occured to me.

MexicoDoug, try this little experiment while in the US-- write down the word
"Allende" on a piece of paper. Show it to every gringo you meet, ask them how
to pronounce it. Better yet, get the whitest looking guy you can find to ask
for you. I woud be shocked if anything more than a small minority of English
speakers got it right.

Also, another issue, I've never heard the large majority of all meteorite names
(and, indeed, possibly the majority of all techinical scientific terms, species
names, etc that are well known to me) pronounced aloud. Except for those who
are professionals in the field and/or go to meteorite sales, I'd say that stands
for most people who are hobbyists in obscure fields that are mostly accessed
through books and the internet, without a local population of like-minded people
to meet with. Back to Williamette, the first (and only) time I have ever heard
that word spoken aloud was in that film Darrly Pitt had someone put together--
that guy was pronouncing it right, I thought he was a rube getting it wrong.

Meteorites can come from anywhere in the world-- which means that you are
potentially faced with knowing the pronounciation rules/phonics for any language
in the world-- does that assume that we should be assumed to know how all those
other languages work when you just see the word in print? (And I shudder to
think of a meteorite named in a Khoisan or similar language that strays
profoundly from Indo-European phonics-- "anyone have a partslice of
clickpopgulp?")

> The problem with "Anglicizing" a word is two fold:
>1) it assumes an ethnocentric approach to the word and

So what? If you get rid of all the words that have been adopted into and
modified to make English, you'll have-- well, I guess you'll have nothing,
English is such a mongrel. Would you rather have English more massively
complicated with exceptions to spelling/pronounciation rules than the chaos that
it already is? I've been reading and writing English for all my life, and I
still have to look up spellings of words (including in this post) because of the
mess that English conventions are. Pronouncing the names of all foreign cities
and countries the same way the natives do in their language would take massive
effort.

> Anyway, of course, you can call your mother or father's sister
>"ant" or "aunt" and people will understand.... But one is correct and
>One is less so.

Right-- "ant" is correct. Only losers pronounce the silent "u".

(Myself, I always wonder how the word "o-rang-utan" to most people is pronounced
"arang-atang")
Received on Wed 23 Apr 2008 11:16:37 AM PDT